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Episode 255: Robert Brunner – Beats by Dre Designer, Founder of Ammunition

Robert Brunner, the Chief Designer of Beats by Dre and Founder of Ammunition, joins the show to share his journey from falling in love with industrial design to shaping design for Apple, Pentagram, Beats by Dre, and beyond. Hear his design principles, how Apple became what it is today, behind-the-scenes stories from Beats by Dre, his most memorable design projects, and what Dr. Dre goes by in the office. This episode covers everything from Jimmy Iovine to the Apple Lisa. Here’s a small sample of what you will hear in this episode:

• Did Robert always know he wanted to design for massive brands
• What was the scene in his house like growing up
• How did he start working for Apple
• Could he tell Apple would become what it is today
• How did he start working on Beats by Dre
• Why did he go back to entrepreneurship with Ammunition
• Does Beats by Dre really test new headphones with “In Da Club” by 50 Cent
• Pharrell

Connect with Robert at AmmunitionGroup.com, on Instagram @RobertDBrunner and @AmmunitionGroup, and on LinkedIn.

Enjoy the shoooooow! Check out the show notes below for much more detail. You can also find the full transcript here.

Show Notes

• Intro & Industrial Design
  • [0:27] Email me at max@maxpodcasting.com to save time with your high-quality podcast and use it as a business-building tool
  • [0:36] Connect with Robert at AmmunitionGroup.com, on Instagram @RobertDBrunner and @AmmunitionGroup, and on LinkedIn
  • [1:39] Oh boy
  • [2:08] Did Robert always know he wanted to design for massive brands
  • [2:43] IBM (International Business Machines)
  • [3:33] What was the scene in Robert’s house like growing up
  • [3:48] 14″ Winchester Disk Drives
  • [4:59] What lessons did Robert’s parents teach him
  • [5:27] Engineering
  • [5:50] San José State University (SJSU)
  • [5:54] Civil Engineering, Alaska Pipeline, Electrical Engineering
  • [6:27] Graphic Design

• Industrial Design at Apple
  • [7:55] What is industrial design
  • [9:13] What are Robert’s design principles
  • [9:40] Physics, Calculus
  • [11:08] Modernism, Postmodernism
  • [11:16] Star Wars, Atari
  • [11:57] Expressionism
  • [12:05] Mario Bellini
  • [12:12] Olivetti
  • [13:51] How did Robert start working for Apple
  • [14:04] Gerard Furbershaw, Jeff Smith, LUNAR
  • [14:37] Steve Jobs, Hartmut Esslinger, frog
  • [15:11] Bill Dresselhaus, Lisa, Mac, Skunkworks
  • [18:24] The Man Who Rejected Apple* by Robert Brunner
  • [18:54] What’s Robert’s favorite memory from working at Apple
  • [19:28] Herman Miller Action Office
  • [19:57] PowerBook, MacBook
  • [22:40] Do You Matter? How Great Design Will Make People Love Your Company by Robert Brunner and Stewart Emery with Russ Hall
  • [22:52] Technology (Tech)
  • [23:00] Could Robert tell Apple would become what it is today
  • [23:24] Bazinga!
  • [24:42] Windows-Intel
  • [25:34] Hewlett-Packard (HP), Sun Microsystems
  • [25:53] Jony Ive
  • [26:10] Such an honor speaking at Podcast Movement ’23 in Denver! Sign up to grab the slides from my session at MaxPodcasting.com/PM23
  • [26:12] Sign up for the Podcasting to the Max newsletter at MaxPodcasting.com/Newsletter and receive How to Edit Your Podcast in Audacity
• Industrial Design at Pentagram & Beats by Dre
  • [27:08] Paula Scher – Wild Business Growth Podcast #110: Legendary Graphic Designer, Principal at Pentagram
  • [27:29] What brought Robert to Pentagram
  • [28:26] San Francisco Museum of Modern Art (SFMOMA), Kit Hinrichs
  • [29:08] Kenneth Grange
  • [29:28] Colin Forbes
  • [30:53] Any day!
  • [31:28] How did Robert start working on Beats by Dre
  • [32:02] Jimmy Iovine, Dr. Dre
  • [33:37] Bose
  • [35:22] Beats by Dre Studio
  • [35:38] Silicon Valley
  • [36:01] Lady Gaga
  • [38:07] Michael Jordan, Kobe Bryant
  • [38:29] Jimmy Iovine Interviews
  • [38:55] Bruce Springsteen, John Lennon

• The Ammunition Story
  • [39:48] AmmunitionGroup.com
  • [39:54] Why did Robert go back to entrepreneurship with Ammunition
  • [40:24] Daniel Weil
  • [42:52] Fuego
  • [44:59] What other projects are memorable at Ammunition
  • [45:14] Square, Jack Dorsey
  • [45:31] VISA
  • [46:01] Square Stand
  • [46:07] Retail, Small Business
• Rapid-Fire Q&A: Music Edition
  • [46:44] “I Don’t Have a Square to Spare!“
  • [46:51] What does Dr. Dre go by in the office
  • [47:42] Does Beats by Dre really test new headphones with “In Da Club” by 50 Cent
  • [48:15] Curtis Jackson
  • [48:18] Shoutout, Alex!
  • [48:31] Universal Music Group (UMG)
  • [49:02] Pharrell Williams, will.i.am, Oliver Stone
  • [49:55] Bono, U2
  • [51:02] Connect with Robert at AmmunitionGroup.com, on Instagram @RobertDBrunner and @AmmunitionGroup, and on LinkedIn
  • [51:51] What are Robert’s Final Thoughts
  • [52:27] Follow the Wild Business Growth Podcast and tell a friend about the podcast. And show love (or roast me) by leaving 5 stars on Apple Podcasts and/or Spotify
  • [52:42] Check out the Wild Business Growth Podcast on Goodpods, where you can see what your favorite people are listening to
  • [52:44] Connect with me on Instagram, Twitter (aka X), and LinkedIn @MaxBranstetter
  • [52:47] Save time with your high-quality podcast. Email me at max@maxpodcasting.com to bring your podcast to life and use it as a business-building tool
  • [52:52] Sign up for the Podcasting to the Max newsletter at MaxPodcasting.com/Newsletter and receive How to Edit Your Podcast in Audacity
  • Theme music: Freestyle Percussion Magik – “Jungle Tribe” – provided by Jamendo

What is the Wild Business Growth Podcast?

Wild ideas. Wild growth. Every Wednesday morning a new entrepreneur joins the Wild Business Growth Podcast to share the wildly creative and unusual ways they grew their business – and teaches you how to do it, too. Hear the minds behind WordPress, Stacy’s Pita Chips, Drybar, NFL RedZone, Big Mouth Billy Bass, the voice of Bart Simpson, and more Wild stories. Hosted by Max Branstetter (that’s me), Founder and Podcast Producer at MaxPodcasting.

How do you start a podcast?

Interested in starting a professional-sounding podcast for your brand, but don’t want to deal with the time commitment of all those behind-the-scenes details? I’ve got you covered. Email me at max@maxpodcasting.com to save time with your high-quality podcast and use it as a business-building tool.

Thanks for listening to Robert Brunner on the Wild Business Growth Podcast. To hear more Wild stories like this one every Wednesday morning, follow the Wild Business Growth Podcast and tell a friend about it. And sketch all sorts of stuff with them while listening to “In Da Club.” Until next time, Let your business Run Wild…and Bring on the Bongos!!

What is the Wild Business Growth Podcast?

Wild ideas. Wild growth. Every Wednesday morning a new entrepreneur or innovator joins the Wild Business Growth Podcast to share the crazy creative and unusual ways they grew their business, and provides tips for you to do it, too. Hear the woman who became the voice of Siri, the man who’s reinventing the sandcastle, how GaryVee’s partners are turning the wine world upside down, and more wild stories. Hosted by podcasting and dad joke dude Max Branstetter (that’s me).

Episode #110: Paula Scher – Legendary Graphic Designer, Principal at Pentagram

Paula Scher, the Principal at Pentagram, joins the show to share her journey from designing album covers to creating logos and graphics for Citibank, Shake Shack, The High Line, The Public Theater, and more. Hear the stories behind her most famous designs, why it helps to sketch on a napkin, how to foster business relationships that last decades, the problem with perfectionism, and her reaction to seeing her designs all around New York City. This episode covers everything from Paula’s bittersweet reaction to the changing design world over time to a relevant Winnie the Pooh quote. Here’s a small sample of what you will hear in this episode:

• Paula’s years designing album covers
• Why is it helpful to sketch on a crappy napkin
• How do you foster healthy business relationships that last decades
• How do you find insights that unlock quick designs
• MAPS paintings by Paula Scher
• What is the difference between painting and graphic design
• How does Paula feel to see her work all around New York City
• What is her favorite font of all time

Connect with Paula at Pentagram.com.

Enjoy the show! Check out the show notes below for much more detail.

Show Notes

• Intro
  • [0:32] Email me at max@maxpodcasting.com for help using your podcast as a business-building tool
  • [0:48] Connect with Paula at Pentagram.com
  • [1:57] Graphic Design
  • [2:14] How does Paula feel about the reduction in album cover art size
  • [2:40] iPhone
  • [2:59] How much has design changed over the years
  • [3:04] Marketing
  • [3:06] CBS Records, Columbia Records, Epic Records
  • [3:19] Product Managers
  • [3:42] How does the increase in team size impact the design process
  • [4:29] Record Stores
  • [4:46] Paula’s work on Boston by Boston
  • [5:06] Bob James, Tappan Zee Records
  • [5:31] Heads by Bob James, One on One by Bob James with Earl Klugh
• Graphic Design at Pentagram
  • [6:12] When did Paula know graphic design was right for her
  • [6:14] Tyler School of Art and Architecture
  • [6:52] The Basel School of Design
  • [7:05] What does Paula like about ideas
  • [7:57] How did Paula hear about Pentagram
  • [8:21] Push Pin Studios, Seymour Chwast, Milton Glaser
  • [8:35] Colin Forbes, Alan Fletcher
  • [8:48] Chermayeff & Geismar, Total Design
  • [8:05] Did Paula always want to work at Pentagram
  • [9:35] American Institute of Graphic Arts (AIGA)
  • [9:52] What would Paula’s younger self have said about joining Pentagram
  • [10:58] When did she hit her stride with graphic design
  • [11:41] Bard College Center for Curatorial Studies (CCS)
  • [11:58] Bard Graduate Center, Susan Weber (Soros)
  • [12:29] American Museum of Natural History (AMNH)
  • [12:42] Nonprofits
  • [12:53] The New York Times Magazine
  • [13:04] Paula’s work on The Public Theater
  • [13:29] 25 Years at the Public, A Love Story by Paula Scher
  • [13:47] How do you foster healthy business relationships that last decades
  • [15:00] Where does a healthy client connection come from
  • [16:09] How do you get insights to unlock the final design
  • [16:28] Paula’s work on The High Line
  • [16:40] Chelsea
  • [16:52] Pro bono
  • [17:02] Watch World
  • [17:33] Paula’s work on Shake Shack, Danny Meyer
  • [18:00] Madison Square Park Shake Shack
  • [18:23] Fast casual
  • [18:32] The High Line Social Distancing Campaign
  • [19:24] The Public Theater Instagram
  • [19:46] What do you look for to create quick designs
  • [21:42] Logo, Design System
  • [22:00] What is a project Paula led people would be surprised to hear about
  • [22:14] How did Paula Scher design the Citibank logo
  • [22:32] Travelers Insurance
  • [22:57] Typography
  • [23:24] Citibank-Travelers Merger
  • [23:47] Architect Lorenzo Apicella
  • [24:23] Why is it good to design on napkins and crappy paper
  • [24:55] Sketchbooks
  • [25:49] Zoom
  • [26:24] Save time with your high-quality podcast. Email me at max@maxpodcasting.com to bring your podcast to life and use it as a business-building tool

• Inspiration & Creativity: People, Hobbies, and Resources
  • [27:22] How do you be and stay creative
  • [27:32] Pentagram’s NYC Office
  • [27:51] Mental Health Coalition
  • [28:56] Perfectionism
  • [29:35] Kenneth Cole
  • [30:49] What hobbies does Paula have
  • [30:52] MAPS by Paula Scher
  • [32:13] Salisbury, CT
  • [33:03] How is painting different than graphic design
  • [34:12] Podcasting
• Wild Business Shoutout of the Week
  • [34:46] Why doesn’t Paula care about creative marketing campaigns
  • [36:34] Wild Business Non-Shoutout of the Week
• Rapid-Fire Q&A
  • [37:29] What is Paula’s favorite font of all time
  • [37:41] American Wood Type, The Morgan Library & Museum, Sans-Serif
  • [38:08] What is a quirk Paula has
  • [38:37] Cartogropher
  • [38:47] What is Paula’s reaction to seeing her design on Citi Bikes
  • [39:18] New York City Department of Parks & Recreation
  • [39:38] Parsons School of Design, The New School
  • [40:08] Connect with Paula at Pentagram.com
  • [40:11] What are Paula’s final thoughts
  • [40:20] Winnie the Pooh, Christopher Robin
  • [40:34] Subscribe to the Wild Business Growth Podcast and tell a friend about the podcast
  • [40:41] Check out the Wild Business Growth Podcast on GoodPods, where you can see what your favorite people are listening to
  • [41:03] Connect with me on Instagram, Twitter, and LinkedIn at @MaxBranstetter
  • [41:07] Save time with your high-quality podcast. Email me at max@maxpodcasting.com to bring your podcast to life and use it as a business-building tool
  • Theme music: Freestyle Percussion Magik – Jungle Tribe – provided by Jamendo

How do you start a podcast?

Interested in starting your own professional-sounding podcast, but dreading the time commitment? I’ve got you covered. Email me at max@maxpodcasting.com to bring your podcast to life and use it as a business-building tool.

Thanks for listening to Paula Scher on the Wild Business Growth Podcast. To hear more Wild stories like this one every Wednesday morning, subscribe to the Wild Business Growth Podcast and tell a friend. Until next time, Let your business Run Wild…and Bring on the Bongos!!