Full Transcript – Jess Loseke – Wild Business Growth Podcast #358

This is the full transcript for Episode #358 of the Wild Business Growth podcast featuring Jess Loseke – Midwest Barrel Co., Used Bourbon Barrels & Wine Barrels. You can listen to the interview and learn more here. Please note: this transcript is not 100% accurate.

[00:00:00] ​

[00:00:05] All righty. We are here with Jess Loseke, co-founder of Midwest Barrel Company, uh, as someone from the Midwest and who loves barrels and companies as well. This is a dream come true. So thanks Jess. Thank you so much. Thank you so much for joining. How you doing today?

[00:00:33] Great. Thank you so much for having me.

[00:00:35] My pleasure. My pleasure. Well, thanks for all you guys do. Um, we we’re gonna get into all sorts of your story involving barrels and bourbon and wine and beer and all that, all that fun stuff. But before that, I have to rip the bandaid off in a very, I’ll call it inappropriate way, but it ties to your business.

[00:00:53] Um, as prep for this, there’s some interesting things I’ve learned about your business and a couple things involving barrels. One being sex toys and one being bungholes. So choose your own adventure. Which of those, uh, would you like to share a story?

[00:01:12] Uh, I mean, let’s just tie ’em together. How about that? That’s, that’s where we wanna start.

[00:01:17] Yeah. Well, it might be,

[00:01:19] Okay.

[00:01:19] well, you can decide if that’s where we wanna end too, but yeah, go. Yeah, go for it. Uh, share, share what those have to do with your business.

[00:01:27] Okay, so we are gonna get right into it. So, um, let’s do a little barrel anatomy for you. So every barrel bourbon barrel anyway, is built from American Oak. American white oak wood, and each barrel has what are called staves, so you can think of those as the slats. They have two heads and they have six rings, and the rings are what hold it together.

[00:01:49] There’s no nails, no screws, no hinges. One of those staves contains a hole in it, and it goes either on the, what is called the belly of the barrel, or it goes on one of the heads and wherever it is that is called. The B hole, which gets lots of chuckles from people outside of the barrel community.

[00:02:11] it’s a, it’s infamous for, uh, from Beavis and Butthead, right? There’s a famous line about it. Yeah,

[00:02:16] know, I am not super familiar with, um, EVAs and Buttheads show, but I could imagine that fitting right into the type of comedy that, that they enjoy.

[00:02:28] there’s some famous line about TP in in Bungholes. We’ll just leave it as that. But anyway, that’s how I first heard about it before the barrel anatomy came into it.

[00:02:37] Yeah, so probably the most, um, crazy story of any barrel that we’ve ever sold was when we were still located in Nebraska and there was an individual that lived in western Nebraska that liked to produce interest rate in interesting contraptions for. Intimate activities, and so he purchased a barrel from us and was going to make some sort of contraption.

[00:03:11] And I don’t know how the B hole was working into that, but I’m sure that’s, that’s as far as I got in my, my questions. We, we left it at that.

[00:03:20] I appreciate that. Um, yeah, and I just threw you through the ringer right away. Uh, don’t always start with every guest talking about bungholes and sex toys, but we’re relevant. You know, we always try to ring it up. So thanks for that, Jess. But, so let’s.

[00:03:33] That’s the most interesting podcast intro I’ve ever done. So

[00:03:38] Great.

[00:03:38] that to the

[00:03:39] It, it’s up there. Well, next week we’re, uh, helping a client launch the Bung Hole podcast, so that should fit well. No, I’m just kidding. So,

[00:03:46] Yeah.

[00:03:48] all right, let’s get a little, a, a little less unruly. Um, let, let’s get to Midwest Barrel Company. And so you hinted at some of the, uh, the interesting ties of the barrel world there, but, uh, I heard that.

[00:04:04] This actually started like way, way, way back in the day. Kind of from your, your husband’s hobby of like buying and selling stuff online. Can you, can you take us through his shoes and kind of your perspective of that?

[00:04:16] Yeah, so when

[00:04:18] I.

[00:04:18] first got married I was working in HR consulting, so I specialized in human potential and positive psychology and traveled quite a bit with healthcare clients, and so I was gone a lot and he was working on his PhD. What is called viticulture. So viticulture is the science of growing grapes, and he had quite a bit of extra time on his hands, and so he started going to garage sales, auctions, estate sales, if you’ve ever seen the show, American Pickers, that was like right at their prime and he was like right in the American Pickers era. So I like to tell the story that he started out buying other people’s junk and reselling it to make money. So he did that from 2013 to 2015. And in 2015 we had our first kid and I thought, Hey, maybe we shouldn’t spend all weekend, every weekend at these auctions, because he was buying farm equipment and collections of things, so he would have to be there.

[00:05:19] Very first to scope out what he wanted, but then he always wanted the most expensive things that went at the end of the day, and then we’d have to go back it. It just was a whole thing. So he decided to start thinking about what’s one item that he could and resell, and he landed on wine barrels because of his connections in the Nebraska Wine and Grape Growers industry. And he started doing that and quickly learned that craft breweries were using barrels to age beer and started getting requests for bourbon, ba barrels. And just this hobby kept getting out more and more out of control. that’s kind of the background story. Do you want me to go into it? How I got into it?

[00:06:01] Yeah. Yeah. Would, would love that. But, uh, I, I think real quick on, on that part, what, what is going through your mind when. Your husband’s spending all of his free time, just like basically a whole black market online of all sorts of different products.

[00:06:17] Yeah. Yeah. So. I, I tell, I get asked a lot, how do you work with your husband? I, I could never do that. I could never work with my husband and I, I totally understand that, but I think the thing that makes us a really unique match is that we both let each other be who we are and we don’t try to change each other.

[00:06:36] And so when he started wanting to do this, it really wasn’t out of, it wasn’t motivated out of making money, it was motivated out of. opportunity and just something that he thought was fun. And so I was super supportive and my support started to change as we started having a family, because he would go to state auctions and buy things, and the police kept coming to our house because he would buy like a bicycle, for example.

[00:07:07] And then he would list it on Craigslist at the time, then somebody would see their bicycle listed, contact the police, and then they would show up at her house. So this was happening fairly regularly. He would go meet people in parking lots. I didn’t love that one to sell. I mean, it can kind of be a bit of a dangerous game, but ultimately he got a lot of joy out of it and I was not involved.

[00:07:29] That was like his thing. And he did his thing. I did mine and we were happy Couple.

[00:07:35] All right. So what turned you into an unhappy, no, I’m just kidding. No, but what, what made you what? What made you realize that it is time for you to join the business as well?

[00:07:46] Well, nothing made me realize. Um, so in 2017 we had our second son and I had a four month old baby and I was getting, I’d gone back to work for maternity leave. I was getting ready for work and I was running through the house, like physically running, and I went around basement. Landing and I slipped off the top of the landing and I shattered my left humerus bone.

[00:08:11] I broke ribs. I eventually had to have back surgery, it was a life changing injury, I took another leave of absence. I tried to go back to work the following January and I just, I wasn’t ready. I still had a ton of physical therapy I needed to do, and Ben was in his last semester of his PhD program, and so I quit my job without a plan. So we were living off of, he worked at, for the University of Nebraska. And so, um, we were living off of his very small salary and then he had this business that took up a ton of time, but we were really, we were funneling every dollar back into it because he would just use that to buy more inventory and. quit my job not ever intending to be in barrels, but he had hired one employee and through 2018 they were with him and I, I had kind of started, you know, showing up a little bit more. then at the end of 2018, that individual quit and we just had kind of our own come to Jesus moment of. Do, do we want this to be a real business or is this a hobby that we need to scale down?

[00:09:19] And ultimately we decided, let’s go all in. reengaged in childcare and I showed up not knowing anything about bar barrels, but I knew how to work really hard and I knew a lot about leadership and scaling, um, companies just from working with other great leaders that I had. And so it turns out we’re a pretty good team, and that’s how I entered.

[00:09:42] I just kind of showed up at work one day and I was like, at least I,

[00:09:47] Uh, I got chills in multiple ways. Uh, one just fired up that, you know, you guys were like, let’s do this. Um, but on the negative side of, um, on the childcare side, you know, we, we’ve learned over the past year how expensive daycare is and that, that’s

[00:10:00] mm-hmm.

[00:10:01] not a fun, but a very, very, uh. Worthwhile cost to add to your, your costs.

[00:10:07] So, um, that’s a, that’s a huge adjustment there. So, alright, so at the start, um, my, depending on who you are, either very impressive or very immature start to this episode. Uh, I shared a little bit of the aspects of the barrel world, but can you just give us a background of like, you know, we don’t need exact numbers, but like, just kind of high level, what, what are your barrels.

[00:10:33] What type of clients do you have? Like most often these days? What are they used for?

[00:10:39] So we have three. The largest amount of barrels that we ship go internationally. So they’re going to go a BA bourbon barrel can only be used or filled one time, but, and it cannot age bourbon a second time, but it’s still a very great product. And so here in Kentucky, distilleries will fill their barrel, they’ll empty it, they can’t use it again.

[00:11:03] That’s where we come in, we buy it, and then in a often as possible, we wanna get that barrel. a second fill because it’s still a super great product. So we ship a lot of barrels to Scotland, Ireland, and India, China. So those are all huge whiskey markets. We ship to over 30 countries, but those are our four biggest ones. it’s not going internationally, which a a barrel for scotch can be used up to 40 years in Scotland. So it’s filled here for four to 12 years, most commonly, and then it can go there for another 40 years to hold more whiskey it’s not used for that, the next. Consideration is can it go to a brewery for craft beer? So craft breweries will use a barrel anywhere from. Three to up to 12 months. Um, probably six to nine months is the, is the sweet spot where most of them will do that. So a lot of them, and that’s where we really grew and got our start, was in craft beer. And then the third outlet is my fa favorite when it goes from our home to yours, where you’re going to use barrels for really cool and interesting projects.

[00:12:07] And so we sell the full barrel, we sell the barrel parts, we sell smoking wood, kind of anywhere in between that we wanna extend that barrel lifecycle as long as possible.

[00:12:17] And now we know that it can be extended in many different ways, but so it’s really cool. It’s like something that, I mean, like I, for a while now, I’ve been a huge fan of beer and bourbon and. Um, you know, anything in, in that ballpark, but I had never really thought of like barrels from, I guess from a product standpoint, I always, you know, if you go check out, if you go to Louisville and check out, you know, whiskey Row there, um,

[00:12:45] Mm-hmm.

[00:12:46] there’s barrels everywhere and all those distilleries.

[00:12:48] But you, I hadn’t really thought about like how many different ways they can be used and how they can be recycled. And so like you guys, it’s like the, the niche of niche in like a cool, cool area and can be used in so many different ways. And now if you look at, you know, like if you go to like a craft brewery, it’s always pretty cool when they have something that’s like a, you know, a barrel aged beer, like a special offering on tap.

[00:13:11] So it’s cool you guys are a part of all that.

[00:13:14] We kind of hit the, um, the sweet spot with that, where we entered the market when craft beer was really exploding.

[00:13:21] Yeah.

[00:13:21] And so we became a, a, a trusted resource because we didn’t just buy one type of barrel. Our goal was let’s bring in all different types. We can be a hub. So if you are a craft. Brewery and you’re gonna do four barrels of beer, maybe one of them is a bourbon barrel, one’s a wine barrel, one’s a tequila barrel, and one’s a rum barrel.

[00:13:41] And so that’s really been a sweet spot of ours, is being able to service customers that can’t afford to buy just a onesie twosie. So we bring them in and then we’re able to distribute everywhere.

[00:13:53] Onesie, twosie. I like it. It’s like samesies from super bad. So the how, okay, so the way you’re, you’re, you’re painting the picture of your husband getting started with this and. Before your injury and everything there, it kind of just sounds like a crazy guy with a bunch of barrels in his house. Um, and now you’ve, which you’re not rejecting.

[00:14:15] Um, and now it’s like you’re this international company that’s got, you know, tens of thousands of barrels at any time and you’re trusted among some amazing, amazing clients. Uh, what did you do personally to like. Change that to like, alright, we’re gonna get this to like a real, like, trusted company.

[00:14:37] So the, the first thing, and I have to give Ben a ton of credit, um, he’s super scrappy. He just starts without all the information. And the thing that he did that really changed everything for us was he put a barrel on the internet. So he actually built his own Wix website, put a

[00:14:55] Hmm.

[00:14:55] on, and then we’ll never forget the day that somebody bought one online. And so what I’m really good at, Ben, is really good at just starting without all the information, like actually to the frustration of our team a lot of times where he just. and I’m really good at coming behind him and putting systems and process and scaling that. And so I’ve been able to really grow our e-commerce, um, platform.

[00:15:19] And so we’ve had, I mean, we did then we moved to Squarespace, then we moved to WooCommerce, and then we’ve built two different Shopify stores. And so we’ve really been. You know, perfecting that. But I think to go back to your question, the key differentiator of what we’ve done is we’ve focused on hiring really great people and put and making that core to who we are.

[00:15:42] So identifying what’s our mission, what’s our vision, and what’s our core values? And really trying to stay true to that and being will, being willing to pivot wherever the business us or takes us to, has allowed us to. Not just narrow ’cause it is a niche category, so you have to be flexible as needs change.

[00:16:01] A couple of years ago you couldn’t buy barrels anywhere. There was such a shortage and today it’s the opposite problem where the spirits industry has changed a lot and so barrels are readily available and so we have to be able to, will be willing and able to adapt as markets change. And because we focused on. Uh, I mean, I, when I hire somebody, the conversation that I have is we move really fast here and we change all the time. And so whatever job that you think you’re getting hired for today, might not be doing that exact same job six months from now. And if that sounds exciting for you, this could be the right place.

[00:16:36] If that sounds intimidating or unattractive, you will struggle to fit in here because we just are constantly evolving.

[00:16:44] I think that’s. That’s something that’s really appealing to a lot of people, especially like new company startup space. I think a lot of people want to, like, they’re craving that entrepreneurial aspect of, I wanna help out any way I can here. Or like, let’s figure out stuff. And there’s something incredibly rewarding about like, if you come up with a new idea, you know, we can get this rolling pretty quickly.

[00:17:05] As opposed to, I mean, I was just talking to somebody on a call earlier who was saying how when, you know, when they worked in the corporate world, they were so frustrated by. It would have, everything would need to go through like three rungs of approval. Um, and you can just go. So that’s really exciting.

[00:17:18] And then, I mean, I mentioned startup, but like now you guys have been around for over a decade, so congrats on that. Like it’s, it’s really cool how far you’ve come and Yeah. Yeah, it’s really, it’s really inspiring. Um, when you look at the, the operation side of things. It’s, uh, I didn’t plan to make this pun, but I’m sorry.

[00:17:43] It sounds kinda like a barrel of monkeys where it can get really complicated really quick if you’re not organized with things. So now, I mean, I heard you mention another interview that you’ve, you know, sometimes can have like 20,000 barrels in your warehouse. So how do you keep things or like, how do you get it to the point that you can run things efficiently and organize at a scale like that?

[00:18:04] So we’ve made a really strategic decision up to this point that we don’t do what other cooperages do. So most of our, our competitors actually make new barrels, or they repair used barrels. And I’m not saying that we won’t ever get into that space, but up to this point, we’ve found that our specialty is really getting the barrel from point A to point B as fast as possible. so we have an inventory management system, and that sounds very basic, but a lot of people in our industry, this is, it’s just very historic. They haven’t, they haven’t needed one. And so they don’t have, um, inventory management systems in the same way. We can’t operate our business without one because we’re trying to move so many barrels, so, so quickly.

[00:18:45] And even when we need to get our barrels repaired, that’s a great example of. They’re still ours, but they have to go, go somewhere. And so just having the tech, the tech has been really critical to us. And I’ve actually strived to lead our business, like tech founders think I went through a program a few years ago, it’s called Pipeline Entrepreneurs, and it’s an amazing um, program.

[00:19:10] And they’re a cohort system. They take 13 entrepreneurs out of Nebraska, Kansas, and Missouri every year. And you go through four different modules. I went through that because it’s mostly tech founders that do it. And I really wanted the experience of learning to think and act like a tech founder because I wanted to build everything tech enabled.

[00:19:32] And now we have these great, all of the platforms that we use are AI driven and were able to move way faster than we would be able to if we didn’t use that.

[00:19:45] Yeah, that’s, yeah, inventory is cra it’s something I got a little exposure to in, uh, just my short time in the corporate world. And it’s kind of satisfying when you can get things organized and you figure out what skews to get rid of. And we call it skew, rat skew rationalization, things like that. But um, man, it can get so complicated and so tedious.

[00:20:05] And what advice do you have for anybody who is looking to get like a handle on their inventory like that?

[00:20:13] Yeah. For us too, our inventory all looks identical and so to, to the layman, the barrel. A barrel is a barrel is barrel. But to us, what matters is what was held inside that barrel. it could be produced by the same cooperage, it could look identical, but what it held, it could contain vastly different value. And the, the best advice that I probably have is that you need to start small and your, and your tech is, it’s something that it’s not a one-time investment. And this was something I had to learn. So I’ll just use my, our website as an example. I came on. So Ben had built a Wix website and then in 2018 we built a Squarespace and I was involved.

[00:21:01] I wasn’t really working in the business, but I was really involved with that website. when I came on full time, I. WooCommerce was my big, my first big project. And the, the goal of moving to WooCommerce is I wanted a way for our domestic breweries to be able to quote an accurate shipping quote from the website.

[00:21:21] I didn’t want them to have to call us because understand how e-commerce works. You wanted, want to get online and see, well, I’m gonna add four barrels to my cart. How much would it actually cost for me to get them there? They don’t wanna call me and ask that. They just wanna be able to see that. And so that was the first. Big project that I did, and when I did that, I thought, oh, we’re done. We’re set. We’re good. I quickly learned that every year you really need to have a CapEx budget for your website, and it’s something that you’re gonna have to continually invest in. And it’s not just, we bought this, the software, we did an implementation, we’re done.

[00:21:59] It continues to require, it’s just like a piece of equipment. It’s just like a, a truck that you buy that you have to maintain over time and then you get so much life out of it and then you have to buy a new it. Tech works. You can’t look at another company of the same size and see where they’re at and think we’re gonna be at the same place just by implementing this one piece of tech. You have to map it out and you have to start with baby steps, because otherwise it gets way too overwhelming and things break, and that’s where your whole operations breaks down.

[00:22:35] And that’s why large companies really struggle to implement. Tech enabled features when they haven’t used them is because it has a trickle down effect and then systems start breaking and they ship the wrong products at the wrong time to the wrong people, and then they stop using it.

[00:22:52] And, and I have to ask you a couple definitions there. You reminded me, uh, cou, cooperage I’ve heard of before, but, uh, technically what’s the cooperage?

[00:23:01] Yeah. A cooperage is a. Facility for barrels, they are going to be somebody that produces a new barrel from scratch or they repair an existing barrel. And, um. It’s a historic practice, so Coopers, um, that they employ what are called Coopers, and it’s a trade and it’s a, it’s a very fascinating trade. And so historically barrels were made by hand, and today there are really advanced manufacturing facilities that can do the majority of it by machine.

[00:23:36] But a Cooper still oversees the process.

[00:23:38] I got it. Yeah. I knew it was something barrel related, but I didn’t know it was like, I thought it was just kind of like a wood factory as well, like if that even makes sense. A wood something like, I didn’t know it was barrel specific, so That’s awesome. There’s a whole like history there too.

[00:23:51] So yeah, so kind of the process is every barrel starts as an American white oak tree that grows somewhere between 70 to a

[00:23:59] They’re all, they’re all oak.

[00:24:00] tree down. They’re all yes, but there, there’s French oak, Hungarian Oak, there’s some other wood types, but American white oak is kind of the tried and true that everybody wants. Uh, and so they grow, you know, up to a hundred years they harvest the tree and then every tree only makes between one and three barrels. so then from there it goes to what is called a stave mill, where they. Take the logs and they produce the staves, which are the slats of the barrels, where the bunghole goes.

[00:24:30] Watch your mouth. I’m just kidding.

[00:24:32] step, the next step is those staves, actually they’re, it’s a process called seasoning. They’re gonna sit outside anywhere from six months up to three years. And then, then when they’re done with that, that’s when it goes to the cooperage. So the Cooper actually assembles the barrel before the heads are put on.

[00:24:50] Everybody knows and loves the fire part of it, so they either toast or char the inside of the barrel. And that char is what gives your bourbon the flavor that we all know and love.

[00:25:00] I feel like I’m back in fifth grade and we learned about the water cycle and, you know, evaporation, condensation, precipitation through the lens of barrels. It’s really, really interesting industry. Um, like who would know that? Well, obviously you

[00:25:12] you there’s a,

[00:25:13] guys Go ahead.

[00:25:15] yeah. Didn’t I tell you there’s a quiz

[00:25:16] Yeah, exactly.

[00:25:18] Yeah.

[00:25:18] pop quiz at that. Uh.

[00:25:20] Yes,

[00:25:21] The other definition real quick.

[00:25:23] I’ve heard of it, but, uh, CapEx, is that capital expenses or is that,

[00:25:27] yes.

[00:25:27] cool. You can tell I didn’t study accounting.

[00:25:31] yeah, and, and again, that’s, more so just thinking about like what areas of the business are we going to invest in. So it’s not, it’s not a monthly expense, it’s not a, uh, what would be considered like a yearly expense. These are, are generally more one time expenses. You can deduct them differently on your, your taxes, but you have to plan for them.

[00:25:53] And if you don’t plan for tech expenses. It’s, it’s really challenging because they sneak up on you and if you don’t plan for any maintenance and something breaks, I mean, I found that that websites, they do break. And so you have to have a plan for what am I gonna do when something doesn’t. We, we actually, we, we moved a couple weeks ago and so we took our website offline and our, um, marketing team was doing some updating while our warehouse team was physically moving, when we turned our website back on. Google had unindexed all of our pages, which we have thousands of pages on our website because every product listing is its own page, and so we’ve had to spend the last two weeks re-indexing, and that’s never a word I thought that I would know what re-indexing on Google is. So it’s just things like that that we didn’t consider that we we’re just like, oh yeah, we’ll pause our website for a week.

[00:26:49] Our marketing team will be working remotely. This will be a great time. We, and then we had to physically move our inventory. We’re like, we won’t take orders, so it won’t be confusing. This will work. Perfect. And then lo and behold, Google’s like, Nope, done.

[00:27:03] Oh my God. Sorry. You have to deal with that. Yeah. That sounds, that’s just like one of those things as a, as an entrepreneur that just like the whole, like anything that can go. Wrong will go wrong. Like you never know what you’re gonna see and what you’re gonna have to deal with there. And internet’s always a, you know, it’s always like wrestling a rattlesnake there.

[00:27:19] Um,

[00:27:20] Yeah,

[00:27:20] so

[00:27:21] sure.

[00:27:21] actually moving was one of the things I was really excited to ask you about. So, um, there’s a big move which we’ll get to, I mean, an even bigger move. But, uh, your recent move, so is that just, is that within Louisville or did you, or What’d you guys do? Okay, cool.

[00:27:35] So we are like pretty much professional movers at this point.

[00:27:40] And, and professional rein indexers.

[00:27:43] yes, exactly. You know, all, all the things. So we, um. Okay, let’s back up ’cause I’m sure you’re, you’re wondering about this. So, when we started in Nebraska, we, I mean one year we moved five times because barrels are very big. And every single time that we, we would move, Ben would say, if we ever fill this warehouse, we’re doing something wrong.

[00:28:03] Because our goal is to get the barrels in and out as fast as possible. And lo and behold, the business continued to grow and so we continued to get bigger and bigger. At one point when we were in Nebraska, we had moved to what I thought was like our dream facility and everything was, you know, finding dandy.

[00:28:21] We had worked so hard to find it. And then we made the decision to relocate from Nebraska to Louisville. clearly the biggest move that we’ve ever done. And it, it was a proce, it was kind of a lengthy decision. Um, we knew we needed to make the move because we were shipping so many barrels from the Louisville surrounding areas, so Kentucky, Indiana, Tennessee.

[00:28:45] We were sending them to Nebraska, and then we were sending them back out to a port to go overseas, and it just didn’t make any sense. we first tried to set up a remote facility in Louisville and that we just couldn’t really get that off the ground. And so then we decided, well, Ben and I are gonna move for six months to a year to get it up and going.

[00:29:04] And then we pretty quickly realized. I think we’re gonna need to move full time. So then we decided, okay, we’re gonna have our Louisville facility and we’re gonna keep our Nebraska facility. And then after doing that for a little bit of time, about a year, we’re like, we cannot continue to have our Nebraska facility. It just didn’t make any sense. And that was, was one of the hardest decisions I’ve ever made as a leader, because we had a really great team in Nebraska that had stuck with us through the move, I had to personally make. The decision of do we keep these people working remote? And we know with COVID that there’s so many more things that you can do remotely, but culture is such a big part of what we do. That there was a lot lost between having half of our team remotely and having half of it in person. So ultimately we brought everything to Kentucky, but there has been an industrial, um. Warehousing shortage ever since we’ve been here. So our journey to find the right location has been really hard. And in 2024, we thought we found the perfect facility, we, um, leased again.

[00:30:14] What was our dream building? It was huge. It was, would allow us to substantially grow bigger and then the market crashed. And so I don’t know how much you’ve been following the spirits industry, but it’s like the housing crash of oh 8, 0 9 is what we’ve been going through. And so ultimately in the last six months, we’ve had to really evaluate how do we continue to operate a, a financially healthy business and reduce our expenses and. Reducing our footprint was the, it was our biggest line item. Um, and so we made the, the difficult decision to move out of our other, I mean, it was a, a beautiful facility and we found a fabulous new facility that we just moved into two weeks ago. It’s quite a bit smaller, but it’s going to function really great for what we’re doing and I’m really excited about it.

[00:31:03] But it’s been one of the, one of the more difficult leadership journeys that I’ve been on has been, you know, the past six months.

[00:31:11] It’s kudos to you for having the, uh. I guess the courage to make those decisions. I mean, those are not easy at all. Um, do you have any advice for any entrepreneur out there who’s kind of struggling with a big decision like that, that could have big payoff, but also has a lot of, you know, scary aspects too?

[00:31:34] Yeah, I think the one thing, looking back there, there, you know, hindsight’s 2020, so you see the things that you did well and then you think, see the things that you wish you would’ve done differently. And the one thing I really wish we would have done differently is I wish we would’ve acted a little bit sooner.

[00:31:51] I think that some of these decisions would have caught, had a lot less angst if we would have. Actively started reducing our costs a little bit faster. And I, I think we really believed what every, all of us in the bourbon industry want is that it’s gotta, you know, it’s gotta turn around, it’s gotta pick back, pick back up.

[00:32:11] It’s going to happen, it’s going to happen. it just hasn’t happened quite as fast. And so I think that that’s the one thing that I, my experience share is like when. As an entrepreneur, we have the closest pulse on what is going on inside our business and oftentimes outside of our business. And even if your advisors or your team members are telling you no, that’s oftentimes because they don’t want the consequences of the change. did not wanna move. We had just moved, not even a year ago, and moving. I mean, I think we moved 6,000 barrels. That is no easy task, and we did it in four and a half days. And that we’ve never done something like that before. I, I wish that I would’ve just trusted our intuition because the result ended up still being the same thing.

[00:33:00] We, we knew we needed to move a lot earlier than we did, and we still ended up having to move, but it was a lot more painful because everybody was a lot less prepared for it because we had to do it so quickly. kind of the, the big thing. The, the other thing that I will say is that, um, when you’re going through. Periods where your business isn’t working in the same way that it once did. Really digging deep inside of you to figure out, well, I didn’t have a plan when I started. I didn’t know what my markets were gonna be or what products I was going to sell. And trying to get back to that, that founder that started it that wasn’t worried about failure because. There, there wasn’t anything to, to lose or to fail, but when things get hard, we get really, we get scared and we stop making, we start making safe decisions. But when you’re going through big changes, that’s actually when you need to make the most bold changes.

[00:33:56] That’s an incredible point. Uh, we, I mean, I’m very guilty of this. Like, it’s nice when you have a business and you get to a point of a certain level of stability and things are clicking and it’s like, it feels so good and you don’t want anything to change, but the reality is like. Every business needs to evolve over time.

[00:34:15] And there’s crazy forces like market forces like you’re talking about, um, that just kind of dictate how this, you know, something needs to change. And so, um, I think looking backwards and trying to, you know what’s funny? I, I, I have a client, um, shout out Shane. He’s got the, uh, the couples therapist couch.

[00:34:37] It’s his podcast. So I’ve learned a lot about couples therapy through this and. One of the things he talks about working on with his clients is like inner child work and how, I guess in therapy, um, you know, it’s common for, you know, to, for him to talk to clients about, like, looking inward and things that, you know, working out with your inner child.

[00:34:57] I’m clearly not a therapist. I don’t know how this works, but it’s almost like you’re, your inner first time entrepreneur work is what you need to do to like, look inward and, and get to that like. Back against the wall, but also, um, just entrepreneurial spirit and that’s what can keep things growing. So I’m, I’m, I’m a big fan of what all you, what you just said there.

[00:35:20] Yeah, you.

[00:35:21] Thank you. Well, you nailed it. I just, you know, regurgitated it and added a random example. Anyway, I trust on that random note. I trust that you’re ready to, uh, switch it up a little bit. I promise. No more question off the wall questions, however, this is, um, this is a segment called The Unusual So Pet Peeves, quirks.

[00:35:40] Weird comments. This is more, doesn’t have to tie to your business at all. Just about you kind of as a founder, you as a person, really. Um, first thing,

[00:35:49] So, okay, before we

[00:35:51] yeah.

[00:35:51] this, um, I saw that you had this on your list and so I asked my husband what he thought was interesting, and he gave me a list of really boring, generic facts about myself. And so I’m concerned, I’m uninteresting, and so I’m very curious to see where we go with this.

[00:36:05] You are very not uninteresting. Did I say that the right way? Not uninteresting. I get tripped up. Yes. You’re very interesting.

[00:36:12] Double negative. I

[00:36:13] Exactly.

[00:36:14] The double makes the positive. Yeah.

[00:36:16] Yeah. It’s so fa uh, we’ve had guests in the past that have asked their significant other or family members for that and it’s so funny to, it’s a fun exercise for any to be like, what’s.

[00:36:25] What’s unique about me in certain ways. So, so that’s fun. So anyway, we’ll, we’ll give him him some crap. But, um, let’s start with quirks. What’s something a little quirky? This could be from you or from Ben, a little quirky about your personality that somebody calls you out for, but it’s who you are.

[00:36:41] Uh, yeah. And this is kind of where we started. So he’s just like, you just, you love to work. And I was like, well, that’s super generic. And he’s

[00:36:47] I.

[00:36:48] he’s like, it’s to a different level where like this is like your brain works. So. Differently. And so parenting young kids, that was actually like being, being a mom, something that was really hard for me because, you know, little toddlers, they don’t, they’re not interested in, you know, dad works with barrels and mom works on her computer.

[00:37:07] That’s what they used to always say. Um, but I think how this is translating now from a quirky perspective. So last night I, did a keynote at Bellarmine University and it was 150 women that were there. And I invited my 10-year-old son to go and we were sitting at the table before I gave the keynote and I was like, Hey Theo, can you tell, can you tell this group, um. What, like what’s your, your biggest takeaway from it? And he said, my framework verbatim to, and he had only heard the talk once. And so from a quirky perspective, like I involve my kids in my work, like they’re going to run this someday. And like this is their, and, and that’s not my goal per se, but. just think I didn’t grow up with this privilege, and they have such a privilege of being able to get exposure to things that none of their peers do. And so I’m trying to get them to start thinking like a founder now. And so I have a very interesting parenting style, so that that’s where I went from. Ben’s like, I work a lot to, like, I have a very interesting parenting style.

[00:38:13] I’m all for that. I mean, I, I grew up with parents who are entrepreneurs. I think growing up with in an entrepreneurial family is so rewarding and definitely helps you think outside the box and think about, you know, problems and solutions in a different way. So, uh, I’m a big fan of your, what we’ll call it, Jess’s, take your child to workday every day.

[00:38:31] Uh, plan.

[00:38:33] There you go. And I did not grow up with parents that were, I mean, my, my dad drove a tractor at a feedlot, a cow feedlot, and my mom was a nurse, or she is a nurse. And so I, that I did

[00:38:43] Yeah.

[00:38:44] that way. And so I, you know, maybe it, it will seem normal to other entrepreneurs or founders, but for the average people, like I just to my kids around to work with me every day.

[00:38:54] Well that’s, yeah, and, and that’s like the best part of it is like, so you’re, I mean, so you had like an in incre, I mean. Fulfilling. Rewarding. Like loving, I’m sure it was absolutely amazing, but you had an incredible different experience and dynamic with your parents as far as work goes than you are and will with with your children.

[00:39:12] I think that’s awesome. Is just like how it changes over generations and um, I guess to an extent the, you know, my. My dad is the same way. Um, like his dad worked at, you know, international harvester forever and before that and, you know, and, and before that it was like farmers and stuff and, and before that.

[00:39:34] And so it’s like, there’s different, there’s different levels of just like what type of work everybody does. And so it’s really cool. And your, your entrepreneurial parenting approach. All right, so that’s, that’s, that’s quirks. Um. We will fire Ben after that one. And then, uh,

[00:39:49] Yeah.

[00:39:49] about, what about weird talents?

[00:39:50] What’s something that’s like, or like a, I call it like a party trick. Well, I call it a weird talent, but it’s like a party trick. What’s something you’re really good at, but it really has no impact on your, your business. A little thing

[00:40:01] I have no special talents. Like I’m a very

[00:40:04] You like to work? No, I’m just kidding.

[00:40:06] Um, yeah, I, yes. Um, I, I guess this kind of goes back to like. It’s not a party trick, but when I was a kid, I really liked to read a lot, so I was actually, I didn’t play at recess. I read books I think that has translated into me being a very rapid learner. And so I am able to consume large amounts of information without getting tired. so that’s kind of my, um. Like my superpower from a party perspective, um, since you use that word. I will tell you my, my biggest flaw is I’m super, super competitive. So much to the point that if I go to a party and there’s going to be a game played that I’ve never played and other people have played it, I won’t play because I will know I can’t.

[00:40:59] Hmm.

[00:41:00] And that it’s a huge, huge personality flaw. Now having children, I’ve tried to expand my, my game repertoire because they also don’t know how to play, and my chances of winning are substantially higher against them. So, so I feel like I am, um, I, so like I mahjong

[00:41:17] Yeah.

[00:41:17] you know, it’s, it’s

[00:41:18] Mj. Yeah.

[00:41:19] with women my age and I didn’t learn for a while.

[00:41:22] Well, then finally I went to a place where there were a whole bunch other people learning.

[00:41:27] Hmm.

[00:41:28] an advanced Rumi cube, which is like my favorite

[00:41:30] Oh yeah, my wife loves that. Yeah.

[00:41:32] think I’m, I think I’m for Mahjong and Mahjong for me, so.

[00:41:37] Oh yeah. I never thought of it like that. Advanced runway. It makes sense. I’ve only seen from a distance, all the little tiles out on a board. Um,

[00:41:45] Well, and they’re very pretty. And so that fits nicely where it’s like very, yeah, very pretty. At the same time.

[00:41:53] Um, okay. And then what about. Pet peeves, what’s something that just kind of ticks you off a little bit, but in the grand scheme of life, it’s not a big deal.

[00:42:04] Oh, I mean, I have a lot. Um, so I think from a business perspective,

[00:42:10] I.

[00:42:10] my biggest pet peeve is when people. I get frustrated with where they’re at and they want to grow, but they don’t know what they want to do and they don’t take any ownership over. Wanting to do it. And I’m seeing this a lot in the Gen Z.

[00:42:29] So I mentor, um, a lot of young women and I’m kind of seeing a very clear split between women that are growing up as athletes and have the discipline to work really hard. And then other women that are getting influenced by the social media culture that you can be a millionaire by the time that you’re 23 That’s just not how, that’s not how real life works. And so as a leader, it’s this constant challenge of trying to mentor people to figure out what makes them tick, because they have to take radical ownership over their own And as somebody that grew up very, very poor, I just can’t understand. Not having a good work ethic.

[00:43:14] And so I, I do struggle with that and I don’t struggle with that a lot in my own business because really, you know, I, I try to find top performers and people that are really, have a strong work ethic, outside of my company, I continue to have these conversations and you just gotta own it. And so that’s a big pet peeve of mine.

[00:43:36] Yeah, that’s fantastic. No matter what happens, whatever changes in the tech world, AI world, everything like work ethic, will always have extreme value. Um, I, I think none of that, that, that will be untouched. Alright, let’s wrap.

[00:43:52] I think

[00:43:52] Yeah.

[00:43:53] continue to see the, uh, bigger, um.

[00:43:55] I.

[00:43:56] A bigger gap between the people that are willing to work hard, because as ai, it affects every single job and role. People that aren’t willing to go out and learn and figure it out are gonna continue to fall lower and lower, where the people that are willing to just start doing and learning, they’re, I mean, that gap is just gonna continue to increase.

[00:44:14] Totally. Totally. Yeah. It works on that level as well. There’s a, the stave between groups will be, no, I was trying to think of a pun. That was awful. Alright, let’s.

[00:44:25] Chat gt those? You can, you can, you know, insert them. Insert them in. I, I can, I feel like you’re, you’re, I like

[00:44:31] Exactly. I like to use my brain sometimes, but yeah. All right, let’s wrap up with some rapid fire q and A. You ready for it?

[00:44:38] Let’s go.

[00:44:39] Alright, let’s get wild. You mentioned a pretty serious injury you had. Um, you know, unfortunately, like in our family, you know, we’ve seen with my father-in-law and my father. My mother-in-law, like I, some of my clients, I swear over the past few years, there was just like a crazy uptick in just fluke random injuries like that where somebody’s breaking bones or has back issues, things like that.

[00:45:04] Um, based on like your experience and your recovery, what tip do you have for anybody that is currently going through something like that where they’re on the in, in recovery mode?

[00:45:14] It kind of just hits on what we were just describing, but you need to take radical ownership over it. I also have an autoimmune disease that I’ve had since I was 20. There’s, there’s nobody else that’s going to own your physical, mental, or spiritual wellbeing. I mean, I’m a big person of faith and I think that when I had that freak injury that I was supposed to have a complete life pivot, but it really took me down to a dark place because I, my entire identity was wrapped up in the career that I had built, and overnight it was gone and, and I had to learn that. A job doesn’t define you. Even now with the role that I’m in, I have to, I have to be very careful that I don’t let that happen. But you do have to take radical ownership and there’s not a perfect balance. So you are gonna wake up some days and figure out, man, I’m super lonely and I don’t have any friends and. You need to go make friends then. And then you make some friends and you realize like, gosh, I haven’t been performing as well at work. I need to work on that. Okay, go work at that and, and then, man, my kid is really struggling in school. I can’t invest in work or friendships now. Okay, well go, you know, you have to just go where life calls you a lot of times, but be really radical and unhinged about your approach in that.

[00:46:27] Radically unhinged. I like it. Uh, yeah. Uncorked un unbanked. All right, so lo, so lowville, which, if you notice the reason I’m, I don’t know if I technically say it right as a local would say it. However, um, I don’t say it as. Louisville or Louisville because my dad actually, my dad’s side is from Louisville and he grew up in, uh, Jeffersonville, like right across the river.

[00:46:53] And so, uh, visited, been there many times. It is a great city. Love that city. Um, what, what’s the, what’s the thing that, since you guys have moved to that area, what’s the thing that you enjoy the, the most about the, uh, L one C four? Now, I know you’re not a Cardinals fan, but.

[00:47:13] I’m a Cards

[00:47:14] You are card fan now. There you go.

[00:47:15] yeah. We decided when we moved here that we, you know, we didn’t have Nebraska anymore, and so let’s go with Louisville because our, all of our red wardrobe transitioned very

[00:47:26] Hey, well welcome you for IU too. You know, just keep going.

[00:47:31] That’s a little further up the road. But then, um, we’re also big volleyball fans, which is huge in Nebraska. And Danny Bus boom, Kelly, who is from Nebraska, she was the Cardinal’s volleyball coach and got to know her well and she’s now back at Nebraska. But yes, we’re, we’re all in on the cards. We we’re all in on the Huskers.

[00:47:48] Um, but the, gosh, the people here are. Just top notch. Um, before we moved, everybody said Louisville’s like a small town, big city, and I didn’t really understand what that meant, but what I, and in Nebraska, there’s, there’s something called, at the state slogan for a while, was Nebraska Nice. And I’ve realized that Nebraskans aren’t nice compared to Louisville.

[00:48:12] Like

[00:48:12] What.

[00:48:13] Nebraskans are just, you know, and. All my Nebraska people, I love you. Don’t come for me. But there’s a different level of hospitality in Louisville that when we moved here, we op, they opened their arms to us and have just made us feel like we have always lived here. And I realized with that. I was like, wow, I didn’t do that when I lived in Nebraska.

[00:48:33] I didn’t, I wasn’t doing that for people that picked up their lives and moved. And I now, I’m like on a mic. If I ever meet somebody and they’re like, I’m new to the city, I’m like, I will introduce you to you. Everyone I know, I’m super passionate about it.

[00:48:46] Well, if your friends family in Nebraska are truly Nebraska nice, they won’t come after you. So appreciate that distinction there.

[00:48:53] Yeah. This is their opportunity to prove that they’re nicer than l. I don’t know if that’s the correct terminology, but we will

[00:49:01] Yeah, exactly. Also, you guys, I mean, you have a business in the bourbon or bourbon adjacent space, so of course they’re gonna welcome you with, you know, gung-ho over the arms. But no, absolutely. Yeah, I agree. Great people. Great place. All right, last one I saw in your Instagram bio, I think it was. Pickleball Pilates and Prosecco, which I’m a sucker for alliteration, so congrats on the three Ps.

[00:49:23] Uh, I use three Ps in my business too. Different three Ps. But if you could only have one of those Ps, what would it be?

[00:49:31] Oh, Pilates for sure. I love, and I probably need to edit that because, um, my mother-in-law would be so. that it still says pickleball because I haven’t played pickleball in a long

[00:49:42] Oh,

[00:49:42] went through it. She’s like, she’s super good. Um, and I, I am not, and so I, I, I got hopped on the trend.

[00:49:50] But if you’ve never done Pilates or lagree before, here is my plug. It will change your life. It will change your body. It, it’s, it is amazing. Um, if you’ve had back pain, we touched on that. It’s, it’s amazing for it. So that’s my, know we were gonna get Pilates in here.

[00:50:05] Of course, of course. Yeah. It’s a wonderful, uh. P to finish with. So, Jess, thank you so much. Um, huge fan of your business, what you and, and Ben and team, uh, Theo apparently as well are, are, are doing. So,

[00:50:20] And

[00:50:20] yeah, Brooks. Yeah.

[00:50:21] forget the, the

[00:50:22] Yeah, exactly. So, uh, thanks so much for making time and, and for all you guys do. Um, I know, and so if people wanna learn more, i, I know it’s, uh, midwest barrel co.com and then I know you’re on LinkedIn.

[00:50:34] Is there any anywhere else that you want people to connect with you guys or you online?

[00:50:40] Yeah, so I’m, um, I’m everywhere. Jess Loki. Um, I also have the, the Barrel Girl handle, um, LinkedIn. I, um, I’m gonna be reviving my newsletter soon, so you

[00:50:51] Awesome.

[00:50:51] um, can certainly follow that there. Um, and you know, I’m, I’ve, I’m on jess loki.com as well, so find me on all the

[00:50:59] Awesome. That’s Loseke. I, I’m terrible at spelling on the podcast, but L-O-S-E-K-E.

[00:51:05] Correct. You can also look up the barrel girl.com because nobody can spell my last name, so trying be smart about that.

[00:51:11] Perfect. And hopefully you can spell the correctly. All right, and the last thing, final thoughts. It could be a quote or kind of words to live by whatever you want. Just like one line, one sort of statement to, uh, send us home here.

[00:51:24] So I just wanna challenge all of the, the listeners that wherever you’re at in your journey, just to be unhinged on purpose and to just go live your best radical lives and take radical ownership over, over that. Be unreasonable in everything you do!